KSMD Challege Poll

Ok so you show up to play your first game. Both teams are warming up and one team notices players warming up in full uniform with the other team that were not on that roster as of April 1st. As the game time gets closer and referee's show up the coach and Manager call for a roster check and it is found that the other team did in fact have players in full uniform warming up that were not on the roster. What should Classic do at this point???? Were they officially cheating..... they never played in the game... I will let you know Classic's response once you all have your hay day!



Let's hold nothing back as I am sure most of you will not do.

Did they line up for the roster check?

Yes they lined up and were presented as legally rostered players. Their coach walked out on to the field with the team and talked to them in spanish while the first roster was being checked. He was overheard giving information to the players however was still allowed to stand out there talking to the team by the league officials and referees until their roster check was started. Two players were removed and the game was played.

They tried to cheat and got caught. I do not care what the technical rule is, they should forfeit every game on the spot. Not only are you teaching your kids it is ok to cheat, but what are you teaching the other teams kids when they move on to Classic and they do not. Do you try the same tactic next year? Why not?

rusty29000 wrote:They tried to cheat and got caught. I do not care what the technical rule is, they should forfeit every game on the spot. Not only are you teaching your kids it is ok to cheat, but what are you teaching the other teams kids when they move on to Classic and they do not. Do you try the same tactic next year? Why not?

Agree with this completely. Let the cheaters coach, manager and parents explain to the kids who were properly on the roster why they are out of the event. Stop fooling around with this ongoing problem. No tolerance policy. Team's duty to make sure its roster is clean. IF they don't, the forfeit is their own fault.

They should have forfeited their tournament games. Let the others duke it out! I would feel bad for the other kids who weren't involved in the cheating so maybe that's why they let them play. But I don't feel so bad that I am tolerant of it. Likely to be a team or club culture to cheat...ongoing.

Mom96keeper wrote:They should have forfeited their tournament games. Let the others duke it out! I would feel bad for the other kids who weren't involved in the cheating so maybe that's why they let them play. But I don't feel so bad that I am tolerant of it. Likely to be a team or club culture to cheat...ongoing.

Age group?

Does it really Matter???????

Kick them out. So sick of age group / roster cheating in select soccer. There is enough of it going on within Classic League already, we don't need to be admitting more teams who are doing it during challenge.

I would echo the comment about "what they are teaching the kids" but I don't think the coaches who are doing it care.

Everyone in each age group already knows who the cheaters are, and there are 1 or 2 in every age group. Classic has taken a flyer on the issue of illegal players, so long as everybody's check clears. Money talks. And brace yourselves, because as the word continues to get out that the rules regarding illegal/over age players is not enforced in Classic League events, the problem will keep gettIng worse.

On Some of these teams, the cheating is blatantly obvious. Classic chooses to ignore their own policies for the sake of money. Everyone knows what is going on. And the teams that cheat help each other skirt the rules. I know it ain't right. As do you. As does Classic. This is the kind of thing that happens when there is not a viable competitive alternatIve. Some would argue Plano and Arlington are viable alternatives. Guess what? You'll find previous threads on this forum that prove the same things are happening there as well. It all really falls at the feet of those making policy and enforcing said policy. Or not. if there is no concern of fairness or honor on the part of league policy makers, who's to stop the cheaters? No one.

And here we are.

In South Texas, every player has a photo I.D. that the coach has to present before every game. If they do not have there I.D. they do not play. There is no reason for this not to be part of our system up here. There are more Indipendent Teams making the climb to Classic than ever before. They are usually the one's that take the risk. Do not know the specifics on this one, but if I was guessing it is either an Indipendent team or a very small club.

Saw this post guest it is rampant in every league even in Classic League.

http://www.txsoccer.info/t5026p30-nothing


Using illegal players in PPL is rampant. By far, most of cheating is with regards to age-ineligible players. CL is already cosidering changing their requirements for entry including possible photo IDs (different from NTX photo IDs) with certified birth certificates or possibly even passport verifications. The problem doesn't exist so much in CL except among a few clubs in the D2 and D3 divisions. However, the perception is there, and CL is doing everything they can to reclaim their image and tighten up the ship.

If you think the problem is just here in NTX, you're missing the real show down in STX. We've played Premier League games over a weekend, and the same team has two completely different sets of players for their two games. AND, only one set of player cards. It's a crap shoot to even get the referees down there to check the cards. One time, they did check ours, but wouldn't check the other team's. Uh huh.... I think the referees had nephews on the other team... hehe.

There were no sanctions because the "undocumented" players did not "participate" in the match, meaning they were not on the field at any time while the ball was in play. This is the least ambiguous, conservative interpretation of "participation", which North Texas Soccer rules require as a prerequisite for sanctions for illegal players. Any issue not specifically covered by tournament rules is covered by NTSSA rules - this was clearly specified by the tournament rules.

The tournament officials must operate according to rules. Without player cards, it is particularly difficult to write a rule that disqualifies a team for having an unrostered player on the bench, in the vicinity of the bench, warming up on the field, warming up near the field, walking across the field, standing on a sidewalk 10 feet behind the team bench, standing on the field before the match begins - you get the idea.

To have the players walk out on the field of play, stand in the line, present themselves as rostered players and try to answers the questions to prove that they are rostered players is not at all ambiguous. Whether play has started or not at this point should be irrelevant. Its cheating plain and simple. If that's how the rules works then no wonder cheating is so rampant.

n2sccr wrote:To have the players walk out on the field of play, stand in the line, present themselves as rostered players and try to answers the questions to prove that they are rostered players is not at all ambiguous.

Agree. I wonder if this could still go before NTSSA A&D and the coach's & team's registration put in jeopardy.

Until a league does decide to strongly and publicly punish a team for such behavior, it will be business as usual. if there are no balls behind the policy, there is no policy.

IMHO as soon as the players walked on the field and presented themselves as rostered players, cheating occurred. The coach knew it was cheating, the players knew it was cheating (depending on age group)and the parents knew it was cheating. At that point the team, players and coaches should be assessed the appropriate penalties.

The only way to get bad behavior to stop is to have swift and stiff punishment. I believe the punishment should be on the team/club, the coaches and the players (again depending on age). In the old days your coach was your role model and helped enforce the values you were hopefully learning from your parents. It seems now it is about doing whatever it takes to get what you think you deserve or are owed. Whatever happened to honesty, integrity, dignity, character and sportsmanship.

In life you do not always win, kids need to learn how to win and lose with character.

Someone just needs to file a complaint it would seem. This is a CL sponsored tournament and CL rules clearly state-
IX.A.15 At all complexes, only the current teams (players and coaches) are allowed on the field (either for warm-ups or the actual game). Thus by rule they were presented by the team as players for the current match.

word is out on them now amongst their age group.......

this is great! hope they keep checking the rosters to be sure there is no cheating.

mfernando wrote:I understand three teams were caught cheating and all three have been disqualified.

They will not be allowed in the CL.

I also was told the league is reporting the teams to North Texas.

So let's publicly out them -- everyone deserves to know who these teams are so we can avoid being associated with the clubs, teams and coaches.

scrdad wrote:

mfernando wrote:I understand three teams were caught cheating and all three have been disqualified.

They will not be allowed in the CL.

I also was told the league is reporting the teams to North Texas.

So let's publicly out them -- everyone deserves to know who these teams are so we can avoid being associated with the clubs, teams and coaches.

Have to agree. If they were disqualified then this board should be able to talk about it. If there is just rumors then I would be more tentative in what to talk about (IMHO)

Classic board members are on this site fairly often, so they would know this is a very good way to get the word out. Guess we will see.

Posted on the classic league website